Stop dropping point values for highly wanted items.

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ClixWizard Posted: 03-05-2010 8:21 PM

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Just because a game was released two years ago doesn't mean it should be worth only 100 points if a ton of people are still requesting it. There are games that I have in my request que in the forty-something range, that hasn't changed. Nobody is trading it because it's incredibly rare. But what does Goozex do? You'd assume that the point value would increase to get people to offer it, but the opposite happens, it goes down in point value. WTF?

Goozex needs to really reconsider how it assigns points to items. I'd gladly spend 200 points to a 100 point item if it would get people to start trading again. But the system as it is just creates blocks for me trying to get games and movies because nobody will trade them for almost no points.

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stoudman replied on 03-05-2010 10:08 PM

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ClixWizard:

I think the time after release value shouldn't be a factor in assigning or changing an items point value. Why can I sit at number 42 in a wait list for weeks and weeks, and instead of the point value going up, it goes down. WTF?

Assuming I understand what you're saying correctly (which I'm not sure of because the second part of what you're saying doesn't seem to match up at all with the first part):

The point value goes DOWN when people DON'T WANT THE GAME. It goes UP when people DO want the game. If you're 42nd in line and waiting to trade out a game and the value of that game keeps going down because nobody will buy it....I mean...really? Do I have to explain the BASICS of frickin ECONOMICS? Supply and Demand? ect?

I guess more than anything I'm just incredibly confused about...what it is you're even complaining about? Could you possibly explain yourself a little better?

So basically, if you're complaining about point values going down while you're waiting to buy a game, what's the problem? It just means you get it for less.

If you're complaining that the value is going down while you're waiting to sell, well that's what it does -- if nobody is buying, nobody is selling; If nobody is able to sell, then in a real economy, in a capitalist society, the seller suddenly becomes more willing to sell what they have for LESS. THIS IS WHAT CAUSES WHAT IS KNOWN AS A "SALE".

-_-;;

All the points are doing is exactly what they'd do in real life. Complaining that nobody is buying and you're not going to get as much for your game as you want is about as pointless and ridiculous as it gets. Come on, man...COME ON!

You're not even complaining about Goozex, you're complaining about capitalism and the economy. How in the world this "blocks" you from "trying to get games and movies" is beyond me. I've recieved plenty of things for 100-150 points. A lot of people are all too willing to sell things for low point values.

I guess what I'm saying here is....there's misdirected anger in your statement that doesn't even make any sense. Ugh.

MAKE SENSE!! FOR THE LOVE OF ALL THAT IS GOOD AND RIGHTEOUS IN THIS WORLD, JUST MAKE...SOME SENSE!!!

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plut.O replied on 03-05-2010 10:12 PM

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I think he's just saying that there are obviously people who want the game and maybe no one is getting rid of it because they think the price is too low. If they are holding on to it and the price gets lower, no one is going to get rid of it. Maybe if they raise the price, the seller will think it's worth it to get rid of it.

At least I think that's what he meant.

And yes, I understand where you are coming from as well, stoudman.

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ClixWizard replied on 03-06-2010 2:02 AM

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plut.O:

I think he's just saying that there are obviously people who want the game and maybe no one is getting rid of it because they think the price is too low. If they are holding on to it and the price gets lower, no one is going to get rid of it. Maybe if they raise the price, the seller will think it's worth it to get rid of it.

 

At least I think that's what he meant.

Thanks, I didn't articulate my intention very well. But you got it.

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ClixWizard replied on 03-06-2010 3:05 AM

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stoudman:

So basically, if you're complaining about point values going down while you're waiting to buy a game, what's the problem? It just means you get it for less.

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stoudman replied on 03-06-2010 4:20 AM

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ClixWizard:

stoudman:

So basically, if you're complaining about point values going down while you're waiting to buy a game, what's the problem? It just means you get it for less.

No, it means you don't get it at all. I'd rather pay more points and actualy get the item then have it be cheap and sit in my wanted list until the end of time.

 

OOOOH! I see what you mean now. Yeah, that bugs me too. I think it just comes from the game being less valuable in certain places but more valuable in others. In other words, you'd rather be able to pay more for it just so someone would let go of it, but nobody wants to let go of it because they find more value in it than they are going to be given for it. The price gets lower because in certain markets the value has fallen, but on this market it is still high.

An example to me would be The Sega Genesis Collection. I recently picked it up for around $15 at Gamestop, there are at least a few people who want the game but nobody wants to let go of it at the $20 price point...or at least fewer people than usual. I'd be willing to since I got it for so cheap, but I'm not willing to let go of it yet because I want to play it some more.

If it's a popular game that people enjoy playing, and you're trying to get it from a community of real gamers (as you see on Goozex), chances are the value that the gamer has for a game often don't match up with the real life monetary value attached to it. This is where I think the difference comes from, and why this becomes a problem sometimes. However, Goozex runs on a system that is rather limited to what affect they can have on such things, so it probably wouldn't be easy or feasible to fix this issue just because it occurs now and then.

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exolstice replied on 03-06-2010 8:36 AM

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I have about 20-30 old  games on my wanted list with 100-200 point values and about 20-40 (or more) people ahead of me and maybe 1 or 2 trades per year. So I'd say this is quite a common problem.

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chaostheory replied on 03-06-2010 8:40 AM

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And what's he's saying is there's a 40 demand for a game, 0 supply, so by economics, there's a demand, no supply, point value should go up.

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Renaissance 2K replied on 03-06-2010 9:20 AM

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My name is R2K, and I support this message.

I understand the need to consider release date in The Algorithm, but in its current state, it appears to be giving older games the shaft.  Many points get dropped down to that infamous 200-point soft cap and stay there unless a very, very large amount of users request it; much, much more than for new titles.

I think The Algorithm should be sensitized a bit more for older titles.  It's working well for titles that are still in print, but once the title is off store shelves, anything goes.

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StilesCrisis replied on 03-06-2010 11:49 AM

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Renaissance 2K:

My name is R2K, and I support this message.

I understand the need to consider release date in The Algorithm, but in its current state, it appears to be giving older games the shaft.  Many points get dropped down to that infamous 200-point soft cap and stay there unless a very, very large amount of users request it; much, much more than for new titles.

I think The Algorithm should be sensitized a bit more for older titles.  It's working well for titles that are still in print, but once the title is off store shelves, anything goes.

Yes yes yes. I wholeheartedly endorse the OP's message and I feel his pain.

The algorithm needs to understand that when there are 40 requests and one offer a year, you don't lower the price. Right now it doesn't seem to understand that.

There are also going to be titles that the algorithm will never be able to handle, unless they actually make it smart enough to trawl eBay/Half.com/Amazon on a regular basis (which would be awesome but I think it may be too complicated). That's why I posted this thread: http://www.goozex.com/community/forums/t/58506.aspx

Unfortunately, the status quo seems to be, a forum moderator will post on any new ideas or suggestions, and say that they're (a) impossible (b) completely unnecessary (c) too hard to code and/or (d) bad ideas. I'm a little sick of the current attitude of "never question The System" even though it's getting more and more obvious that the system only works well for new release games, and falls apart for older titles, DLCs or box-set movies...

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mafafu replied on 03-06-2010 12:00 PM

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StilesCrisis:

Renaissance 2K:

My name is R2K, and I support this message.

I understand the need to consider release date in The Algorithm, but in its current state, it appears to be giving older games the shaft.  Many points get dropped down to that infamous 200-point soft cap and stay there unless a very, very large amount of users request it; much, much more than for new titles.

I think The Algorithm should be sensitized a bit more for older titles.  It's working well for titles that are still in print, but once the title is off store shelves, anything goes.

Yes yes yes. I wholeheartedly endorse the OP's message and I feel his pain.

The algorithm needs to understand that when there are 40 requests and one offer a year, you don't lower the price. Right now it doesn't seem to understand that.

There are also going to be titles that the algorithm will never be able to handle, unless they actually make it smart enough to trawl eBay/Half.com/Amazon on a regular basis (which would be awesome but I think it may be too complicated). That's why I posted this thread: http://www.goozex.com/community/forums/t/58506.aspx

Unfortunately, the status quo seems to be, a forum moderator will post on any new ideas or suggestions, and say that they're (a) impossible (b) completely unnecessary (c) too hard to code and/or (d) bad ideas. I'm a little sick of the current attitude of "never question The System" even though it's getting more and more obvious that the system only works well for new release games, and falls apart for older titles, DLCs or box-set movies...

I find it impossible and completely unnecessary for Goozex to try to code (impossibly no doubt) such bad ideas. I have no idea why you would question the system, since it works wonderfully for new releases.....

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exolstice replied on 03-06-2010 3:20 PM

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What does the pizza icon signify?

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larpi replied on 03-06-2010 3:21 PM

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it signifies pizza

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stoudman replied on 03-06-2010 3:31 PM

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chaostheory:

And what's he's saying is there's a 40 demand for a game, 0 supply, so by economics, there's a demand, no supply, point value should go up.

OOOOOOOOOOOOHHH!

Thank god someone finally explained it in a way that I could understand. It's kind of hard to come from reading heavy duty critical theory stuff that requires a college level of reading to understand, and go to this type of stuff. It leaves me completely lost -- because often times these "theorists" never even say what they're attempting to say, and then I check out the Goozex forums and it's like trying to understand someone who speaks in broken english.

This isn't meant to offend anyone, I'm just explaining why it's been so hard for me to understand just what is being argued against here.

I think I got close with my last post, though. I still kind of hold the same belief, sadly.

For all you know there could be piles and piles of that game somewhere at a goodwill or something. Just because the supply is short in the Goozer community doesn't mean the supply is short around the world. I think the "algorithm" probably works based also on how many copies of the game have been sold to date, affecting how much supply of the game their is.

However, the one thing I would not expect to find is anything in said "algorithm" that accounts for copies of said games that become unplayable or get otherwise destroyed. There's probably nothing to account for the time factor, the fact that older games sometimes don't hold up to the test of time and/or to the test of the incapability of the owners of the game to keep them in good, working condition.

If you want to suggest a change, I think this is where it should come from.

However, as the history of this thread has shown, I could just be totally off base here.

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mafafu replied on 03-06-2010 4:14 PM

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exolstice:

What does the pizza icon signify?

for me signifies humorous sarcasm. For others it signifies, no offense. The can hold many toppings.